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Post by Puss In Boots on Jul 16, 2004 2:02:51 GMT -5
We all know his UK sales are very impressive, but if you are going to pile in here to argue for him not being a "clown or idiot in the world we call pop" your reasons need to be a bit more relevant and less wanky. If you are going to raise the issue of his sales proving he must be brilliant then be prepared to explain why he's not had anything like the same success elsewhere. Exactly, his fans always seem to ignore the fact that he has not had any success abroard, I can name loads of UK stars that have done much better than Will, his fans will make the excuse of lack of promotion, but that's really not the whole story it dosn't explain the success of Katie Meluor, of Jamie Callum. Will has been overseas and I guess they found him out to be a prat! They saw him for what he really is , they don't see him through rose coloured glasses like we do in the UK. Australia thought he was a stuck up posh twat! The Germans didn't get him, and the Dutch and the Italians only let him have one hit before ditching him. And despite almost half of America tuning in to see him perform on the final of US Idol they also found him unimpressive when standing next to Kelly Clarkson. I consider the only people that are more arrogant than Will Young himself are his team of snotty hardcore fans that crawl out of the woodwork everytime his name is even mentioned. Singing his praises to anyone that will listen and treating him like some kind of musical messire thats come to rid the world of bad-singers and mimers! As if Will is the only singer in the world ever to have sung live on national TV....As If!
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Post by Jaylo on Jul 16, 2004 2:05:23 GMT -5
This is hilarious. If you'd bothered to read this site before signing up to tell us all what's what you'd know Robbie is considered to be a pretentious wanker and that the majority of members do not rate the value of singers/popstars according to their sales. However, if a fan signs up to promote their favourite and wants to come in and say that he must be brilliant and deserves to be up his own arse because they've 'sold more than Robbie' then they deserve the type of responses above. Big sales do not justify nor excuse acting like a tosser, if you are acting like one. Why aren't these same people off defending Usher on the grounds of his amazing sales? He, Dido, Katie Melua and Jamie Cullan and many people with big selling albums are abused on this site. Other artists get slagged off for failing to light up the international scene, so it's not exclusive to Will. We all know his UK sales are very impressive, but if you are going to pile in here to argue for him not being a "clown or idiot in the world we call pop" your reasons need to be a bit more relevant and less wanky. TEXT. Because Will is only 2 years into his career - and only 1 really because the first year was all about Pop Idol hype and not about success on his own merit. Will is an album artist - I don't think his music particularly suits 3 minute singles, so it's going to be a lot slower for him to break into the markets abroad without a lot of promotion and live performances. To tell the truth nobody knows whether he'll get any success abroad, I hope he does but it's not easy for any artist. I don't agree with you that Robbie is a prententious wanker, by the way. I folowed Robbie's career for years and he's far from the arrogant person he's portrayed as. Seems to me that anyone who gets any success has the jealous oiks who will try to pull them back down. Human nature eh?
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FeelsLikeSex
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Post by FeelsLikeSex on Jul 16, 2004 2:37:31 GMT -5
Is anyone else fed up with Will being labelled a 'Soul' or 'Jazz' artist? He is neither. If the music he sings was sung by any other artist it would be labelled as middle of the road pop. Just because he is a fan of jazz and soul does not mean that the music he makes is either
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Post by bearloverme on Jul 16, 2004 3:13:31 GMT -5
I am fed up of having Will rammed down my throat as being superior, because he sings "live" and isnt "pop" big deal he sings live(though I do wonder sometimes, as evidently his backing singers mime on some shows, how does that work) I dont judge popstars on their ability to be "live" all the time, I would be concerned if Pavarotti mimed, or some other professional vocalist, or Musical stage artists mimed on stage, His voice isnt that special live or not - And as for all this Jazz nonsense - he is not jazz, he is as most people would agree "middle of the road" or "elevator music" - "lounge" I really get annoyed that his fans put down everyone else in the business, as someone says "miming" being the excuse for much rubbish being posted - Pop is pop, meant to be enjoyed, not over analysised. And as for sales, they may be big compared with many others - but its just a drop in the ocean compared with the number of people in the UK.
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spikeydude
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Post by spikeydude on Jul 16, 2004 9:50:42 GMT -5
Personally, I love Will because his voice is far superior to nearly all Pop acts, and I don' t care whether he is wildly successful elsewhere as long as he keeps making music - in many ways I would prefer him to not be as popular so that it was easier to get access to concerts and things...
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flufff
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Post by flufff on Jul 16, 2004 11:22:17 GMT -5
If he's that much better than other pop acts why don't you stay on his site and leave this site for all these other, rubbish pop acts alone?
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spikeydude
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Post by spikeydude on Jul 16, 2004 11:41:35 GMT -5
If he's that much better than other pop acts why don't you stay on his site and leave this site for all these other, rubbish pop acts alone? he is superior, but I do like other artists *points at signature* and I like some of them for the actual songs they sing rather than their voice, with Will I like what he sings, but it is his voice that makes them amazing for me
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Post by Puss In Boots on Jul 17, 2004 2:02:06 GMT -5
AHHHHH! the shear arrogance of Will Young is only matched by the arrogance of his hardcore fans! But of course that is only in your humble oppinion. I am prepared to admit that he has a reasonable techinical voice which hits the right notes in the right places although he does vary them from performance to performance which is no mean feat and he does have a unique lisp which adds to the comedy element. Whats wrong with Will Young is is that he thinks and believes that he is a lot better than he actually is, when asked why was his album doing so well in the UK and he arrogantly replys "because people want to hear "great singers" nothing to do with the amount of money spent on promoting him then?" Having watched his performance on PITP my oppinion has been confimed, he is a cold performer, who just loves his own voice so much that he won't even let the crowd sing his songs back to him, his performace is selfish and all about me, me, me. As for his on stage banter it was cringe worthy there are far worthier performers out there who had a better connection with the crowd. Will Young maybe a natural singer, but he is not a natural performer in any scense of the word.
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Post by bearloverme on Jul 18, 2004 12:20:13 GMT -5
Personally, I love Will because his voice is far superior to nearly all Pop acts. there, that's what I mean. In your opinion you mean. I personally don't like his voice. And I agree he has become a really self indulgant singer, loving the sound of his own vocals so much he forgets about any connection with the audience or the song. Any one see the TOTPs performance. He was so far up his own papper. He believes he IS the best singer in the world.
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slug
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Post by slug on Jul 18, 2004 14:47:50 GMT -5
there, that's what I mean. In your opinion you mean. I personally don't like his voice. And I agree he has become a really self indulgant singer, loving the sound of his own vocals so much he forgets about any connection with the audience or the song. Any one see the TOTPs performance. He was so far up his own papper. He believes he IS the best singer in the world. How do you find the time in your busy life as a psychologist to contribute to this thread so many of Will's thoughts and actions to us?, anyway thanks for keeping us informed with your latest medical report on him ( 6 so far)and also thanks to your other colleague "puss in boots" who analysed Wills performance at PITP and found his performance to be "arrogant and selfish", "cold" and "cringe worthy," well thousands disageed with you and went out and bought his album this week. I hope Will carries on being a clown and an idiot as obviously it's working for him.
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Post by Jaylo on Jul 18, 2004 14:58:33 GMT -5
AHHHHH! the shear arrogance of Will Young is only matched by the arrogance of his hardcore fans! But of course that is only in your humble oppinion. I am prepared to admit that he has a reasonable techinical voice which hits the right notes in the right places although he does vary them from performance to performance which is no mean feat and he does have a unique lisp which adds to the comedy element. Whats wrong with Will Young is is that he thinks and believes that he is a lot better than he actually is, when asked why was his album doing so well in the UK and he arrogantly replys "because people want to hear "great singers" nothing to do with the amount of money spent on promoting him then?" Having watched his performance on PITP my oppinion has been confimed, he is a cold performer, who just loves his own voice so much that he won't even let the crowd sing his songs back to him, his performace is selfish and all about me, me, me. As for his on stage banter it was cringe worthy there are far worthier performers out there who had a better connection with the crowd. Will Young maybe a natural singer, but he is not a natural performer in any scense of the word. Quote: Sorry but you have forced me to print a review from someone who has actually attended a Will concert. : Quote: Evergreen Will rounds off in style An exuberant Will Young rounded off the Summer pops in style on Monday with his impeccable vocals and charismatic performance. Meinir Gwilym took to the stage as the first act of the night, just hours before she was due to attend her own graduation ceremony at Bangor University. Meinir who has a strong local following proved popular as she took to the concert stage witha few familiar numbers to warm up the crowd for the performer of the evning, Will Young. The Pop Idol then took to the stage in his trademark scruffy attire for a cracking set which included favourites like Light My Fire, Your Game and his version of the Outkast track Hey Ya. He also performed his 'summer song' the Paul McCartney song My Love, giving a great mix to the evening's songlist. Mobile phones could be seen everywhere as concertgoers tried to share the evening with family members and friends. Will's personality shone through as his set continued, enjoying banter with the crowd and his band alike, even trying out a bit of Welsh at one point. His performance completely engaged the crowd, the majority of whom seemed to thoroughly enjoy his broad repetoire of songs and smooth dance moves (From Welsh newspaper)
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Post by cherrycola on Jul 18, 2004 18:45:20 GMT -5
Gareth is bigger star than before By Becky Sharpe Mar 1, 2004, 16:09
Anyone who thought Gareth Gates would soon fade into oblivion like the rest of the Pop Idol losers was wrong. For at his first solo headlining gig at Birmingham's NEC last night, the stammering ex-choirboy was replaced by a confident singer with sex appeal.
No longer the quiet Bradford teenager who once hid behind his songs, Gareth took to the stage with the coolness of a seasoned star.
Clad in baggy jeans and a blue leather bomber jacket, the 19-year-old opened his sell-out show with his debut hit Unchained Melody to a screaming, mainly female crowd, and instead of moving swiftly through the programme, Gareth just could not keep quiet.
Amazingly, he chose instead to talk to the 11,000 strong audience about his speech problems, peppering the show with anecdotes.
Gareth carried the show with the utmost confidence, singing tracks from his new album including Sunshine and Suspicious Minds.
The audience went wild when he performed energetic dance routines and to show he was not just a pretty face the star thrashed out a tune on an electric guitar, played two piano pieces and managed to perform an impressive drum solo.
Dances AND plays 3 different instruments on stage. Totally different in class to the so-called Pop Idol, who can't even PLAY THE FOOL properly.
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Post by Jaylo on Jul 18, 2004 23:49:35 GMT -5
LOL I'm completely confused as to why you answer my post with a review about Gareth Gates? I posted the review in reply to the person who said Will couldn't relate to his audience, because the article contradicted that. Your Gareth review is pointless here and out of context. Did you mean to put it in the GGG-Gareth thread by any chance?
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slug
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Post by slug on Jul 19, 2004 1:47:50 GMT -5
Shall we continue with Will v Gareth or just agree to dissagree? It all seems so pointless, as each respective fan is just going to continue posting how good, bad or better or worse they are. For myself , at the moment being a Will fan is good and I'm looking forward to seeing him again soon, so why don't all GG's fans find something better to do with their time and find out when he's coming back with new material and stop harping on about the past. If he comes back with a no1 single and 1.5 million selling album, a sell out theatre tour, festival tour and a 15 date Arena Tour you can compare him to Will in a different topic.Will is a clown and an Idiot and I love his voice and the way he performs and that's why Will's fans love him, he's not around to convert everybody into liking him, he's around for the people that do like him, the same as every other performer is.
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Post by bearloverme on Jul 19, 2004 1:49:37 GMT -5
I was stating why he is a clown, which is my right in this thread(look at the title)and while watching him warble, and repeat lines and words over and over in varying ways or adding little yay yay yays it is obvious he enjoys the sound of his own vocals. No medical report just what it looks like to me. As for thousands "rushing out to buy his album" so what? that doesnt make him less of a clown in my books. BTW I take it you are a Willfan by the way you have resorted to personal jibes. Do you suppose everyone who dislikes Will is in league with the devil? I have no colleague, this isnt some conspiracy - yup actually some people do think Will Young is a clown. I do agree however that a Gareth review seems quite misplaced here. Especially as he has seemingly vanished since May when that review was written. Are we to take it the GG and WY fued is continuing here? the WY review is totally irrelavent too as it goes. a good review from someone(very probably a rabid Willfan judging by the "smooth dance moves" comment(I have seen those moves)) at a concert doesnt stop him being an idiot. See , now its seven times I have contributed to this thread, could be more soon because I expect next time I pop in, some willfan would have made some more jibes at me for posting my opinion. Actually its quite fun. I havent been jumped on before on forums. As mentioned earlier lots of artists get slated but they are not deemed as needing this sort of level of defence by fans.
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Bootie
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Post by Bootie on Jul 19, 2004 2:24:33 GMT -5
The Will vs Gareth "debate" ( and I use the term VERY loosely) bores me shitless and never ever gets anyone anywhere.
Can we drop it. This thread is about Will .....and people's views on Gareth have no place in it.
There is another thread about Gareth, and people's views on Will have no place in that.
Sorry to rant here, but it is so over and so boring
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slug
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Post by slug on Jul 19, 2004 2:32:43 GMT -5
Hello, Will fan and clown and idiot lover here, also a closet lover of his crappy cheesy dancing, you just don't get it do you? I'm not jumping on you at all, I'm trying to get across to you that Will fans love him for all the reasons you find him inferior. Gareth is far too much an accomplished performer for me, I can't be doing with all this polished performing and multi talented instrument playing, voice of an angel crap, I'll just settle for my clown and Idiot thankyou very much and I adore the way Will plays the tambourine. waits patiently for reply no 8. I agree, it is fun isn't it?not.
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Post by Puss In Boots on Jul 19, 2004 4:54:37 GMT -5
Ahh Jaylo how wonderful of you to print a concert review from a little Welsh local rag. Its funny that you didn't choose to print a review from the Evening Standard Londons biggest evening paper, I believe that reviewer wasn't watching Will 's performance through rose coloured specs and saw the performance that most non-Will fans. I do believe that review was slightly less complimentry perhaps you should print that one and maybe the truth is somewhere in between.
Thousands of album sales only means that some people are a little like lemmings! He is flavour of the month in the UK, but that does not make him any a better artist than someone that only sells a few hundred. It only means that people want to buy and see whats popular not whats good! You have no idea how many take the album home, play it once and discard it vowing never to buy another one! Wasn't that just the case with Craig David 2 years ago. Didn't he have the must have album and wasn't everyone one in the industry so far up his arse you could almost see them spilling from Craigs mouth. Didn't everyone want to work with him? Didn't he have exclusive rights to the playlist....ahhh yes he was flavour of the month too. Poor Criag! what was his crime? Only that he too had his head up his own arse, he too believed he had the public at his feet, but look at what happened, no one likes a show off....Will beware!
I'm not a Gareth fan, but I do feel sorry for him and the way he has been cruely spat out by the industry and the way Will fans gloat a this young boy is equally sad when you consider most of them are old enough to be his mother and some cases even his grandmother! Gareth fans may have had digs at Will from time to time, but lets face it most of his fans are children so therefore a little bit more exceptable.
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Post by MilkMonitor on Jul 19, 2004 4:59:24 GMT -5
You have no idea how many take the album home, play it once and discard it vowing never to buy another one! Nor do you, I imagine.
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Post by Puss In Boots on Jul 19, 2004 5:05:38 GMT -5
Me for a start! I took it home played it once and gave it to my Mum! It's more her scene anyway I believe it's going down a storm at the OAPs home where she lworks.
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Keaty
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Post by Keaty on Jul 19, 2004 5:34:29 GMT -5
Me for a start! I took it home played it once and gave it to my Mum! It's more her scene anyway I believe it's going down a storm at the OAPs home where she lworks. Your point being? He's still selling CDs then, even if they are to OAPs. It seems you are trying to make Will seem unpopular with some vague generalisations and opinions based on nothing but malice. The facts sometimes speak for themselves you know.
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Post by bearloverme on Jul 19, 2004 5:57:04 GMT -5
Hello, Will fan and clown and idiot lover here, also a closet lover of his crappy cheesy dancing, you just don't get it do you? I'm not jumping on you at all, I'm trying to get across to you that Will fans love him for all the reasons you find him inferior. Gareth is far too much an accomplished performer for me, I can't be doing with all this polished performing and multi talented instrument playing, voice of an angel crap, I'll just settle for my clown and Idiot thankyou very much and I adore the way Will plays the tambourine. waits patiently for reply no 8. I agree, it is fun isn't it?not. sarcasm is the lowest form of wit, but at least you admit to being a Willfan and thus I take no notice of your throwing your rattle out of the pram. and I don't appreciate you "trying to get across" to me as if I am missing something - I assure you I am not.
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Storm
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Post by Storm on Jul 19, 2004 5:57:45 GMT -5
Can we lock this thread??
The will and gareth trolls are really, really annoying. Are you all twelve??
They're only making music. How can you all be so systematically nasty about people you've never even met??
There are popstars I don't like, music I don't like, but people here are making assumptions about their character based on nothing. None of you can say Will is arrogant. You might get that impression, but it doesn't make it true.
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Post by bearloverme on Jul 19, 2004 6:46:29 GMT -5
I dont think it should be locked, Will is at home here as much as all the other popstars, and they get scathing posts about them without people asking for the threads to be locked. All would be well if the gareth v Will fan thing didnt keep rearing it's head. And that probably wouldn't happen if Will fans didn't insist on defending and getting outraged whenever something negative is posted about Will.
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Storm
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Post by Storm on Jul 19, 2004 6:53:48 GMT -5
Which is fine, but this isn't a Will V Gareth board. And I object to people coming onto this board solely to slag one artist off, be that Will or Gareth. That isn't the point of this board.
If you read through this thread, I have said that I also didn't appreciate some of his recent performances. But no-one is putting forward lucid, well thought out arguments in this thread, it's just petty bickering. Will fans bashing Gareth, and Gareth fans bashing Will, and both lots are as bad as each other - it's quite childish and pathetic.
If you all want to do that, you should go somewhere else to do it.
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spikeydude
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Post by spikeydude on Jul 19, 2004 8:16:39 GMT -5
I believe someone mentioned a few pages ago that Ronan Keating sold the same amount of albums that Will did for his FIRST album - but let us not forget that Mr. Young is doing this all for the SECOND time around - From Now On wasn't just a complete ride on the back of the Pop Idol phenomenon you know, it was released a good 8 months after the last show was broadcast, so I believe it should count for something, and hints at the fact that he will have staying power over and above other artists. Another factor that leads me to believe that he will be around for a decent length of time is that his fan base are not all teenagers or even pre-teens, the majority, it would seem, are from the far less fickle 30+ age group, who will stick with an artist through thick and thin, rather than abandoning him when something else is 'cooler'. This is not a slight against teenagers in any way, it is the truth - how many people who loved David Essex on his motorbike as a 70s teenager follow his career quite so avidly now?
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Storm
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Post by Storm on Jul 19, 2004 8:36:19 GMT -5
I don't think sales are part of this argument at all. Everyone knows Will has been successful. People are saying they don't like him - quoting sales aren't exactly gonna sway them in the opposite direction.
I actually quite like Will's music and voice, but just because he's been sucessful, doesn't mean he's good. Look at Thicke, who you mention in your sig. His album is one of the best of the last few years but has flopped in pretty much every single territory..........
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Post by Jaylo on Jul 19, 2004 8:42:08 GMT -5
Ahh Jaylo how wonderful of you to print a concert review from a little Welsh local rag. Its funny that you didn't choose to print a review from the Evening Standard Londons biggest evening paper, I believe that reviewer wasn't watching Will 's performance through rose coloured specs and saw the performance that most non-Will fans. I do believe that review was slightly less complimentry perhaps you should print that one and maybe the truth is somewhere in between. Thousands of album sales only means that some people are a little like lemmings! He is flavour of the month in the UK, but that does not make him any a better artist than someone that only sells a few hundred. It only means that people want to buy and see whats popular not whats good! You have no idea how many take the album home, play it once and discard it vowing never to buy another one! Wasn't that just the case with Craig David 2 years ago. Didn't he have the must have album and wasn't everyone one in the industry so far up his arse you could almost see them spilling from Craigs mouth. Didn't everyone want to work with him? Didn't he have exclusive rights to the playlist....ahhh yes he was flavour of the month too. Poor Criag! what was his crime? Only that he too had his head up his own arse, he too believed he had the public at his feet, but look at what happened, no one likes a show off....Will beware! I'm not a Gareth fan, but I do feel sorry for him and the way he has been cruely spat out by the industry and the way Will fans gloat a this young boy is equally sad when you consider most of them are old enough to be his mother and some cases even his grandmother! Gareth fans may have had digs at Will from time to time, but lets face it most of his fans are children so therefore a little bit more exceptable. I I picked that review because it had a reference in it to Will's connection with his audience, which is what we were discussing. I could have picked numerous others, equally as good from both local and national papers. You mention the one -yes ONE- bad review he got. You can all rant and rave all you like-we've heard it all before. Facts and statictics speak for themselves. Nobody can pretend to know how long his success will last, but for now he's doing more than OK thanks very much. And again, why are you bringing up Gareth??-you give yourselves away with your petty jealousy.
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Post by Puss In Boots on Jul 19, 2004 9:18:01 GMT -5
I picked that review because it had a reference in it to Will's connection with his audience, which is what we were discussing. I could have picked numerous others, equally as good from both local and national papers. You mention the one -yes ONE- bad review he got. You can all rant and rave all you like-we've heard it all before. Facts and statictics speak for themselves. Nobody can pretend to know how long his success will last, but for now he's doing more than OK thanks very much. And again, why are you bringing up Gareth??-you give yourselves away with your petty jealousy. I brought up the Evening Standard review because that one said that he had little connection to the audience, off course we can all post reviews to highligth things that we want to see. As for Gareth I couldn't give a toss about him either way, I just said found it pathetic that Will fans like to slagg him off when as we all know Will fans are of the more "mature" varity and therefore should be above such things. Personnally I don't believe Gareth has any more star quality than Will , also at his height of fame he was just as much up his arse as Will is now. You have got to stop thinking that if anyone has the bull to say they don't like Will it has to be a sad Gareth fan becuse believe it or not, not everyone in the UK loves Will! JUST ONE QUESTION THAT WILL FANS SEEM TO AVOID ANSWERING.................If Will is this music saviour that the World has been waiting for, then WHY has his songs flopped in all the other countries that did not see him in Pop Idol? Will fans like to put it down to promotion, but thats crap! He had as much as any other British artist being released to the world yet his songs failed to impress. The only reason he is doing so well in this country is that his manic fan base pester every media outlet telling them how wonderful Will is spreading the word untill we are all sick of hearing it. We are told that he is a fantastic song writer, I put it to you that he is just very lucky that he has been given the very best producers and writers and that the best song on the album LRN wasn't even co-written by him yet he seems to get the credit for it all the time. I believe that he only actually co-wrote about half the album so he's not even in Craig David's or Robbie's league when it comes to writing songs yet he's hailed as some kind of writing genius!
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Post by barefoot on Jul 19, 2004 9:20:38 GMT -5
I am honestly fascinated to see that Will fans are starting to be referred to as Willfans. Are they that notorious a group that they're getting their own proper name now too?
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